IDK if this has been covered yet but I relocated the black box instead of removing it and installing a T fitting. I hope this helps some people out. Seemed a little easier to do this than to keep worrying about oil puke.

Also I don't know how well this works with the stock air boot due to the hose being on the brake side instead of the clutch side like the ex boot.

Here's how I did it.


I crammed the box in between the ex boot and the rear brake fluid reservoir and zip tied it to the middle seat mount/frame.

The vacuum line that goes from the box to the stock air boot, trim about an inch off both it and its outer protector thing. That goes from the lower port on the box to the crank case (replaces the short hose) and get routed over the rear shock ressy not under. Under pinches it really bad.

The line that goes from the valve cover to the top of the box will now be used as the box-air boot hose.

Go to a parts store and buy about 2' of the same size hose and that will be used for the box-valve cover tube.

Voila! Now the box it moved away from the MCCT/ACCT for easy removal/adjustment and you don't have to worry about the T fitting and little air filter oil puke threat.

It is a tight squeeze where the box is and I will fab up some sort of better mounting than zip ties but I ran out of time today. Maybe I will use a piece of thin metal and drill 2 holes into it to go from the rear brake reservoir mounting bolt to the stock breather box bolt to hold it in place more securely.

Like it says, pics will be up as soon as I get the camera and the mounting tab fabbed up.

If you look at bigairx400's pic right here it is located to the right of the yellow shield for his intake, under the blue frame and to the brake side of the intake hose.

Quick Pic

i cant see chit in that pic.... i will be relocating mine sometime

That is not mine. I was trying to explain a little.

I will get pics up hopefully tomorrow.

where are the pics?
The oil vapor clogged my fuel filter I had in the line, and it'ce creating pressure.. so I'm gonna relocate it to the rear or front.

I was going to go to the front but I didn't realize how big that box really is and how there is really no place for it.

i might go ahead and look at making another bracket for this myself while i am waiting on my shocks. if i come up with something i will post back. im thinking i could probably attach it to my splash guard for the esr

Dang I tried that and it didnt work, but I must of done something wrong!

just remove it then. it seems as if this subject comes up a few times a month. I guees next time i have my plastics off i'm gonna take many pics and i'll start a new topic to end the black box mystery. I'm considering doin it this week. whos interested?

and i might sell a kit with detailed instructions and pictures. anyone interested? I can have it pieced together and sent out the same day.

The T fitting idea is cool but the main reason I relocated my box is to keep the stock factor.

That way I know nothing will go wrong and I don't have to worry about it puking oil on wheelies or just randomly.

i totally understand

I think that it's possible for sure to get rid of it.. but I don't wanna get caught in a 20 lap main event and the filter get clogged and puke oil.
The oil vapor had clogged my filter (as said above)

So to keep from having any problems I'll just hide that ugly black turd somewhere under the seat.

i use a uni vent filter (this is what was made for too) and i have not had to change it yet.

exact reason I slapped mine back on. I didn't really want to mess with it anymore and I had other things to do that were more important. A little bit of modding and I got it to work/fit back in the stock spot

I tried to end that little mystery for a year and a half. Good luck to you. Seriously.

For those of you that want to relocate it, just make sure you place it as high, or higher, than the stock mounting location. Relocating it to a location that's lower than stock isn't going to work for very long.

Also, oil comes up out of the bottom of the engine at high RPMs - not out of the hose going from the box to the valve cover. Many people think that the box works by trapping excess oil coming out of the valve cover, and that's just backwards to what really happens. The excess comes out of the jug, into the bottom of the box...

Its pretty much a PCV System. Mine is mounted about an inch higher than stock.

Like you said Norm, good luck with getting rid of it. I searched and only found topics discussing the best way to remove it and everyone says there is no best way. eventually it will fail and start to mess up or puke. So I figured the easiest thing to to is to just relocate it to somewhere else.

Main reason is for MCCT mod Adjustments. That 1/2 bolt head is 3/4".

I relocated mine under my headlight. I haven't made a bracket for it yet so its still zip tied for now but it works great.

I'm thinking of putting mine around the headlight somewhere.. so it's tall enough.

Hey NormalZ, I get a little oil out of the V/C vent, you mean to say that the oil rises up inside the engine enough to come out of that return tube?

I think the main problem is that its not like a solid tube full of oil comes up out of the cylinder to just drain/drip back into the valve cover. It is a hot oil vapor, so naturally it would probably rise right up out of the crankcase vent instead of going back into the valve cover

i'm wonderin if because I essentially have a loop from the bottom vent to the top with, with my T being at the top vent...if thats why I dont have a problem? Hmmmmm. ive always had it at least a few inches higher than the engine too.

ideally if u had the T, the crankcase vent would be coming out of the bottom tap, imo

Install clear tubing like I did 5 years ago, and you'll quickly see where the oil comes from. I'm not joking. It doesn't come from some kind of overflow from the cylinder head - that box is there to control the oil that comes up out of the bottom of the motor. Cut the black box open with a Dremel like I have, and find out what's inside of it - when you see the chambers in there, you'll be shocked, and trying to figure out why Big 'Zuk did what they did. When you see everything happening through the clear tubing, you'll completely understand why they did what they did...

Why have I been saying the same chit for the last 5 years about this? Why have I recomended using clear tubing on the box lines to people, so they can see what's going on with their own motor? Why has NO ONE listened, or installed the clear tubing and WATCHED what's going on?...

I have no idea why. You guys do what you want, try to re-invent some kind of wheel, and try to figure out why Edelbrock quit including the T-fitting and instructions for Black Box removal from their carb kit. Once you all solve that, you'll own the world.

I can adjust my MCCT just fine with the Black Box in it's stock location. Want pics?..,

Easy Norm.. just asking.
I've already decided to just relocate it on the bike, jut gotta find a good spot.

the G spot?

The A spot. Its deeper than the G spot.

I like the clean look it has now. Its all tucked away and looks better and still functions the same way.

Do they use the same baffle box on the Drz400?

Ah, no worries, Zoph - this crap just keeps coming up, and someone's gonna invent some way of getting rid if it and sell kits. Go for it - hope it works, and they make milions. I played with this long enough to know it's not gonna work (the elimination of it) just because I got some parts in a carb kit box.

I actually mounted mine to the steering stem area for awhile, but it was exposed above the plastics and looked like chit, so I re-mounted it right back to the stock location. Remounting works, if it's in a location higher than the stock position. Go for it, man.



Yes, and no... Same exact dimensions on all three chambers, but shaped slightly different - the DRZ box wouldn't work on the LTZ frame, wouldn't clear the LTZ exhaust location when mounted, and would make life even harder if it was swapped onto the LTZ...

I will eventually get around to making some tabs for the relocation. Probably going to re-relocated mine up to the headlight area.

When I get it all figured out I will me making brackets for it. I will send them out to anyone who wants one, it will be free. It will not come with hoses. But I will let you all know what size and how much it takes.

I think the best rte to take is the relocation and not removal. Like Norm said, there is a reason why they designed it this way. But I don't think there is a specific reason for its location other than space, looking cleaner there due to shorter hoses, and its pretty much centered between all the ports.

Psssssst!!!...hey Tom...we can adjust our MCCT`s w/o any problem w/ the black box being in the way...it`s the guys that are turning the stock ACCT into an MCCT that are havin` the problems w/ the clearance...apparently it sticks out a bit farther than our`s do...I just wanted to get ya on the same page on that part man!!!

Now as for you LTZGuy...

This VERY TOPIC is the reason we don`t get along...it all started around what?...late last summer or so if I remember right) w/ you & you`re way of absolutely w/o a doubt insisting that the black box can be eliminated w/o any problems (it wasn`t in this thread...it was in one of the other one`s that concern this eliminating the black box topic) I merely told ya about how Tom had tried for over a year & couldn`t come up w/ a solution to it...& you started in w/ your talk about how you`ve done it & it`s been that way for like 1 1/2 yrs. or so & you`ve never had a single problem w/ it. You went on to start talkin` something to the effect of how that maybe Tom doesn`t know much or isn`t the best mechanic & that he`s not the only one that`s a knowledgeable mechanic around here & that you`re a pretty good mechanic yourself or some crap like that...it`s been awhile & I`m a little bit fuzzy on the exact wording of it now (we can just go & dig that thread up & re-reference if we need to in order to see exactly what it was that ya said). Naturally when I mentioned to ya that perhaps maybe ya don`t ride your`s hard enough (like I know Tom does his on an MX track) for long enough to make it puke out all over ya...& also that perhaps you & Tom should compare certifications w/ each other. I`m sure it probably offended ya & added a bit of fuel to the fire.
Then...to top it off...the way ya were ALL THE TIME braggin` in the "chat thread" about how your Z is like the fastest Z around & you`ve like never been beaten by anyone you`ve lined up to race against in your sand drag stuff & how your Z can whip up on EVERYTHING & ALL ya ever wanted to chat about was sand draggin` stuff ONLY...well that CHIT got old REAL FAST. If I remember right, I told ya that just because it`s fast in a straight line across the sand that doesn`t mean that it`s fast around a track.
Like I said back then...if that`s what you`re into & it`s your thing...that`s FINE w/ me...it REALLY IS!!!...I can respect that & I can respect all of you guys (& gals too) that are into that stuff. I mean hell...I don`t mind listening to sand draggin` chit chat some (until it turns into one BIGAZZ`d pizzin` contest anyway...which it seems like that`s most usually what ends up happening sooner or later!!! OR until that one moron/idiot just keeps on keepin` on & harpin` endlessly about his quad is the fastest quad on this planet that mankind has ever known...now just WHO could THAT possibly be?!?!?! *COUGH*LTZGuy*COUGH) but the way whenever anyone else started to mention MX...or XC...or Oval/TT type stuff & you didn`t want to listen to it/chat about it AT ALL rubs me the wrong way. Ya should take some social behavior lessons from Tersejr & LittleMissE...I don`t re-call ever seeing either of them CONSTANTLY bragging about how their quads are virtually unbeatable in sand drags like YOU like to do!!! (& I`m fairly certain that they`ve both won their fair share of the times they`ve lined up against others they`re raced) nor do I ever re-call either of them not willing to listen to or chat about anything other than duning & sand dragging. At least they`re open-minded enough to respect us other`s out here that are more into riding the trails & tracks.

Those are the reasons why I don`t care for you & I`m sure the feeling is mutual...& w/ your attitude...I don`t see either of us changin` how we feel about each other anytime soon!!!

So why don`t ya go ahead & quit beatin` around the bush about it & hash it out w/ Tom & explain to him just how you`ve already solved the black box elimination problem w/ all of your mechanical wisdom & you have the proof of X amount of time now that you`ve had it done & ya haven`t had any problems w/ it pukin` out oil & chit.

LMAO....you must be bored! I guess I was too reading your story. And no I never said Tom doesnt know much. I can see what your trying to do, pit others against me. Kool. Kindergarden stuff. Think what ever you wanna think guy. I'll just ignore you for now on...that works on children so I'm sure it'll work on you! LOL!!!

You know...he's right in a sense--you're all talk--for now.

Do us THIS favor...go out and snap a quick picture of the side of your quad where the black box SHOULD be and bring it in, download it to the computer, and post it up here...just to prove to US, the "NON-believers" that it can be done...especially someone who worked on this project for over a year on his very own quad and fully determined that it's NEARLY impossible to remove the box.

Is that a hard request to meet? Go ahead, make up the excuse that you don't have a camera...

Go even one step better, put the date stamp on the picture so we can all verify that the picture is current (if you don't know how to do it--consult the owners manual).

I don't understand what anyone thinks that an "all-talk" attitude does for them...because in the end, it just bites them in the a$$.

I believe you LTZ-guy...............but I would like to see a picture or two of the whole set-up.
So far not one person has posted a pic.

.

mosey on over to this link http://suzuki.theatvchannel.com/invision/i...mp;hl=black+box
as i posted pics a few months ago. if your still not convinced, i'll take a few more pics for you this evening. I might even take the plastics off of the tank depending on how spunky i feel when i get home.

Alright man, that's pretty cool there. So really...I guess the question is and I have absolutely no information to back up this but how hard to you ride your quad versus how hard did Tom ride his when he was testing out this "invention" if you will?

Like I said, I have absolutely NO information to back up what Tom did OR didn't do when he was testing this theory and I have absolutely NO information on how hard you ride yours or even what you do with yours.

I would tend to think though that it's ONLY going to puke oil when the quad is in a wheelie and/or the ever living sh*t is being run out of it for a long period of time. If you ONLY do a 300+ ft. drag with yours then putt back to the line with the quad...I deem that this "invention" would work wonderfully-otherwise I think that if you go out and climb hills and ride wheelies for a day, I would tend to think that it'd have to puke eventually...

Again, I have absolutely NO information to back up this information, but that would (to me) be the only way that the quad would puke is to "level" out the filter with the black box location, or even get it remotely close by climbing hills or doing wheelies.

I dont just drag 300'..here a pic of the bike and some more pics with the date stamp







do you need any more pics?

do you have the hose running over or under the cross brace where the coil mounts?

under

hmm... thats where mine was so i figured thats why the oil would just go past the v/c vent cuz it could kinda collect their.

mine i noticed smelled like oil after i rode it in the rain so i looked and the filter was soaked so i took it all off and washed the filter. then when i was tearing the quad down i noticed oil spill on the gas tank and frame and rad scoops all on the top.

i wonder if oil weight has something to do with it too

You know what...........I do kind of remember the pics now that you posted them again.
Thanks
I've got the oversized gas tank and it tightens things up above the valve cover and also extends farther out past the stem. Might create some issues for me, but I'm gonna try it when I put my quad back together.

I don't know why everybody's busting your balls about this so much. Obviously it works for you or you wouldn't be so passionate about it.........hope it works for me too!

i usually run 10w40 castrol 4 stroke oil, right now im runnin 15w40 rotella

just watch it very closely. when you start romping on it you will want to make sure you don't lose any oil. it makes a good mess and too much gone could make some serious problems.

I think I might be able to get mine to work but I'm not messin with it right now

the only problem i see with your quad ltzguy it the acct that you still have bolted on that big ol motor.

im not going to say that it can't be done. i think some of it has to do with how much blow by the engine has. i know i file my ring gap a little larger than some just for added security for my own feelings. like when i put in my 434. i used .015~.016 ring gap. some people dont even check this and just throw them in.

i think it has a ton of factors to deal with. Tom races MX so his quad is wide open for however long the race is. then he is jumping 90' jumps so the oil gets all sloshed around.

i think with a little ingenuity it can be done. i mean suzuki did it so why cant someone else. I not going to try it because it dont bother me enough to spend hours on end trying to get rid of that thing.

on ltzguys quad i think the length of the tube has a lot to do with it. i bet if his rode it long enough the oil would make it to the top but the hose is so long he could ride all day with normal riding and never reach that point. but i bet if he was in a 1/2-1 hour hairscramble or xc race that thing would be throwing up everywhere... just depends

theres no problem with my acct. i cut the spring on it to lighten the load on the chain, plus i have a 4/5 chain. no problems since ive had it like that. also, the hose used to be much shorter, it used to run toward the rear, had a hole drilled in the airbox with the rubber hose going through. i moved it because of the deep water riding i do. if water gets into the airbox, it may get sucked into the intake, but at least water wont have a straight shot into the crank case.

I filed the rings wide because of occasional nitrous use.

I've got a clear-tubed Alba 470 stroker that gurgles oil out the bottom (clear) tube on fire-up. I'll grab a vid of that thing this weekend - if anyone needs it. You can't stop this thing from spitting oil by removing the Black Box. It can't be done. You can contain it for a little while, but you're not gonna stop it.

Here's something for everyone to think about - if it could be stopped from blowing oil with a simple T-fitting and some other parts down the road (like Edelbrock thought), then why did Edelbrock drop that part and the instructions for it from their carb kit?... Didn't work...

I put too many hours into this thing on my own time, not trying to make any money, but just to get a "system" to work - the Edelbrock LTZ Carb Kit. The thing didn't work. Edelbrock Motorcycle Division saw that, saw the research, and dropped it from the LTZ carb kit. I'm no dumbass. I worked with *username* "bonk" on this board with this thing for a damn long time, and it just didn't work.

Now - do what you want. Try to eliminate it, try to make yourself bigger than me and Edelbrock and prove us all wrong - do whatever the hell you want to do. I hope you succeed, and you whip it. I doubt you will. I can guarantee nobody here has tested this thing like I have - including you, LTZGuy. Go make a million.

Never did see any pictures of the "relocated" black box.............
You've almost convinced me not to eliminate it but I would still like to relocate it.

Where's the pictures!

I'm getting to it. Can't find my digi and it cost like $5 per picture I send on my cell. So taking 5 pics. Ehh no way. Hehe.

BTW I rode it all last week in the mountains which was streams, roads topping out 5th, couple jumps, huge rocks, hill climbs, technical trails. And each day was a 4 hour ride and I had no problems yet.

Did you relocate it or did you eliminate it?

I just relocated it. Figured Suzuki put it there for a reason and I'm not trying to worry or have the thought in the back of my head of it puking oil.

I'll go look for my Digi again today and take my plastics off and see if I can get some pics.